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	<title>Comments on: Safety Net: The Path to Slavery</title>
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		<title>By: rancherlady</title>
		<link>http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/safety-net-the-path-to-slavery/comment-page-1/#comment-3748</link>
		<dc:creator>rancherlady</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Oct 2009 11:26:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/?p=5416#comment-3748</guid>
		<description>I have been considering charming Christina, who wants to punch us in the face, and the ever courteous Doug.  The primary difference between our Antipodes is that I just want others to leave me alone to run my life as I see fit, taking the consequences, and I think they are crazy, whereas those on the other side of the spectrum hate me and wish me evil.  I find that very confusing.  I&#039;m such a nice, sweet lady, and I do so much good in my community...

Doug brushed aside the danger of having the weight of a couple of vehicles smashed across our roof unexpectedly during a brief, violent storm.  The pictures are really quite daunting, and it took two days to cut away enough so that we could use two of the seven doors to the house.  I think that is a real issue here:  WE own our own home.  WE solve problems as they arise.  WE don&#039;t go running to the government, we assemble with chainsaws, hoists, ladders, our bucket truck, and two trailers to haul off the debris.  WE turn the logs into firewood and feed the leaves to cattle and goats.  WE clamber around roofs, tarp over holes, and set pans in the kitchen during on-going rain for weeks while waiting for insurance settlements.  WE get hot, tired, sweaty, and aching.  OUR storm was totally unexpected, and that tree has stood since 1843.  We trim our trees, but when the main trunk goes halfway up from the forces, that is how things are sometimes.  

How DARE we think our behavior is &quot;normal&quot; and &quot;competent&quot; and &quot;adult&quot; and denigrate those who cannot make decisions for themselves, far less good ones?  Quite easily.  The laws of nature are inexorable.  The laws of man are capricious and destructive.  Katrina, Rita, and Ike were not subject to the will of man, and the US was very fortunate to escape a bad hurricane this season.  Socialism has never worked, and &quot;Mother Earth&quot; laughs at it.

Those who choose to believe in the perfectability of man and the omniscience of totalitarian governments have nasty shocks every time there is a natural or &quot;man made&quot; disaster.  With rising unemployment, reckless government expenditures, graft, and corruption, and falling tax revenues the Nanny State becomes &quot;responsible&quot; for more and more bits of incompetent humanity--the result of government intervention into education, family lives, and religion-- with less and less abiility to care for its &quot;children,&quot; aka &quot;voters.&quot;  

When the Greater Depression, perhaps with a devalued dollar and/or cessation of sufficient oil imports and driving bans, comes into being...we shall see yet again which group fares best.  The &quot;children&quot; can howl for help and demand succor, but it will not be forthcoming.  I don&#039;t see any of you arguing with James Howard Kunstler...

Great grief, didn&#039;t your mothers tell you about the Three Little Pigs?  Or the Little Red Hen?  Did they even read Goldilocks and the Three Bears to you?  Push is coming to shove, people, and the world will demonstrate again that life is &quot;nasty, brutish, and short.&quot; 

 It is time to stop being abusive grasshoppers and go to being ants.  Nobody owes you a living, safety, &quot;free&quot; medical care/housing/food/utilities/education, or a rainbow coalition.  It has always been dog eat dog, and the beasts are slavering.  Why don&#039;t you people go start Lemonade and Marshmallows, sing Kum Bah Yah, and agree amongst yourselves that we are dreadful people.  We&#039;re busy furthering our abilities to take care of those we love and ourselves.  

Charity begins at home.  In a society which can afford it, it spreads to churches.  When bureaucrats take over, it&#039;s time to emigrate.  I would, too, if I knew a less socialistic cess pool I could get to easily.  

Oh...grow up.  One of these days soon Nanny is going to stop your allowance.  The supposedly &quot;untouchable&quot; Social Security crowd was just told we will have NO COLA increases for the next three years AND a 20% increase in fees.  Hey, we&#039;ll change brands of cat food, that&#039;s all....who needs cable TV or cell &#039;phones... 

Imagine the fun when the welfare crowd, now in its eighth generation, gets whacked.  Those folks seem to express themselves rather violently.  They think they are &quot;entitled&quot; to whatever they want, at least the illegal Hispanics think they are &quot;entitled&quot; to everything they want, and you may have heard of La Raza, &quot;the Race,&quot; which thinks they are entitled to California, Texas, Arizona, New Mexico, and anything else which strikes their fancy.  

Our southern border is a  joke, and every additional illegal that makes it to safety and produces a child  adds many, many more mouths to feed...children to be &quot;educated&quot;...stresses on the emergency rooms they use as family doctors...and the dwindling revenues the 25% of us who pay taxes lose half or more of what we earn to provide against our will.   How insane is it to pay for those who break our laws?  Citizenship was never intended to be applied to lawbreakers and invaders.  That provision was to cover current residents and their children who resided in the new Republic.

Good question, Christina and Doug.  Do YOU pay taxes?  INCOME taxes?  Over half of all US citizens do NOT.  That doesn&#039;t count the illegals, who don&#039;t, either.  How long do you think that we, if you pay, can continue to fund lifestyles of idleness?  Why should we, the rest of us?  It would make more sense to stop enabling the mentality of dependence.   And...I really have no interest in how you provide for yourselves.  I am neither related to you nor acquainted with you, and neither of you has been so little as polite. 

It isn&#039;t any fun being Cassandra, Christina, Doug, and those who believe as they do.  I do not proclaim Doom &amp; Gloom for fun.  I&#039;m crying &quot;Wolf!&quot; for real while sticking my finger in the dike.  BAD times are coming, and your precious governments and votes aren&#039;t going to be able to do a thing about it except shoot people and confiscate private stores.  

You haven&#039;t gotten the real message:  for all those you envy because we have &quot;more&quot; than you do, there are untold thousands who lust after what YOU have.  WE are robbed by threat of fines and incarceration.  Those below you on the socioeconomic scale may well take from you at the points of knives and guns, by their fists, by their mobs.  We have &quot;more&quot; than you because we did without while others whooped it up in the credit bubble.  We worked forty years and saved.  We looked for bargains.  Everything we have is invested in our ranch, our livelihood and security for the future--if no one wrests it from us by force.  Many will want to.

If you have a vehicle, you could buy and sell something like seven average Chinese families on the proceeds.  No, I don&#039;t expect to be invaded by the Chinese.  Not for...thirty years, maybe?  COULD happen then.  Probably won&#039;t, because the USA will have become a third world country nobody wants.   Instead of railing at me for being your usual insults (mean-spirited, selfish, prejudiced, heartless, the whole meaningless catch phrase assortment), I suggest, yet again, that you look to your hole cards.  You have three choices coming up:  you can be prepared and protect what you have...or you can die...or you can take by force what you have been stealing by force of numbers.  If you wish to continue this discourse, move it over to www.thetexasring.com.  If you want to go away and sulk and call me names, that&#039;s fine, too.  LBT</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have been considering charming Christina, who wants to punch us in the face, and the ever courteous Doug.  The primary difference between our Antipodes is that I just want others to leave me alone to run my life as I see fit, taking the consequences, and I think they are crazy, whereas those on the other side of the spectrum hate me and wish me evil.  I find that very confusing.  I&#8217;m such a nice, sweet lady, and I do so much good in my community&#8230;</p>
<p>Doug brushed aside the danger of having the weight of a couple of vehicles smashed across our roof unexpectedly during a brief, violent storm.  The pictures are really quite daunting, and it took two days to cut away enough so that we could use two of the seven doors to the house.  I think that is a real issue here:  WE own our own home.  WE solve problems as they arise.  WE don&#8217;t go running to the government, we assemble with chainsaws, hoists, ladders, our bucket truck, and two trailers to haul off the debris.  WE turn the logs into firewood and feed the leaves to cattle and goats.  WE clamber around roofs, tarp over holes, and set pans in the kitchen during on-going rain for weeks while waiting for insurance settlements.  WE get hot, tired, sweaty, and aching.  OUR storm was totally unexpected, and that tree has stood since 1843.  We trim our trees, but when the main trunk goes halfway up from the forces, that is how things are sometimes.  </p>
<p>How DARE we think our behavior is &#8220;normal&#8221; and &#8220;competent&#8221; and &#8220;adult&#8221; and denigrate those who cannot make decisions for themselves, far less good ones?  Quite easily.  The laws of nature are inexorable.  The laws of man are capricious and destructive.  Katrina, Rita, and Ike were not subject to the will of man, and the US was very fortunate to escape a bad hurricane this season.  Socialism has never worked, and &#8220;Mother Earth&#8221; laughs at it.</p>
<p>Those who choose to believe in the perfectability of man and the omniscience of totalitarian governments have nasty shocks every time there is a natural or &#8220;man made&#8221; disaster.  With rising unemployment, reckless government expenditures, graft, and corruption, and falling tax revenues the Nanny State becomes &#8220;responsible&#8221; for more and more bits of incompetent humanity&#8211;the result of government intervention into education, family lives, and religion&#8211; with less and less abiility to care for its &#8220;children,&#8221; aka &#8220;voters.&#8221;  </p>
<p>When the Greater Depression, perhaps with a devalued dollar and/or cessation of sufficient oil imports and driving bans, comes into being&#8230;we shall see yet again which group fares best.  The &#8220;children&#8221; can howl for help and demand succor, but it will not be forthcoming.  I don&#8217;t see any of you arguing with James Howard Kunstler&#8230;</p>
<p>Great grief, didn&#8217;t your mothers tell you about the Three Little Pigs?  Or the Little Red Hen?  Did they even read Goldilocks and the Three Bears to you?  Push is coming to shove, people, and the world will demonstrate again that life is &#8220;nasty, brutish, and short.&#8221; </p>
<p> It is time to stop being abusive grasshoppers and go to being ants.  Nobody owes you a living, safety, &#8220;free&#8221; medical care/housing/food/utilities/education, or a rainbow coalition.  It has always been dog eat dog, and the beasts are slavering.  Why don&#8217;t you people go start Lemonade and Marshmallows, sing Kum Bah Yah, and agree amongst yourselves that we are dreadful people.  We&#8217;re busy furthering our abilities to take care of those we love and ourselves.  </p>
<p>Charity begins at home.  In a society which can afford it, it spreads to churches.  When bureaucrats take over, it&#8217;s time to emigrate.  I would, too, if I knew a less socialistic cess pool I could get to easily.  </p>
<p>Oh&#8230;grow up.  One of these days soon Nanny is going to stop your allowance.  The supposedly &#8220;untouchable&#8221; Social Security crowd was just told we will have NO COLA increases for the next three years AND a 20% increase in fees.  Hey, we&#8217;ll change brands of cat food, that&#8217;s all&#8230;.who needs cable TV or cell &#8216;phones&#8230; </p>
<p>Imagine the fun when the welfare crowd, now in its eighth generation, gets whacked.  Those folks seem to express themselves rather violently.  They think they are &#8220;entitled&#8221; to whatever they want, at least the illegal Hispanics think they are &#8220;entitled&#8221; to everything they want, and you may have heard of La Raza, &#8220;the Race,&#8221; which thinks they are entitled to California, Texas, Arizona, New Mexico, and anything else which strikes their fancy.  </p>
<p>Our southern border is a  joke, and every additional illegal that makes it to safety and produces a child  adds many, many more mouths to feed&#8230;children to be &#8220;educated&#8221;&#8230;stresses on the emergency rooms they use as family doctors&#8230;and the dwindling revenues the 25% of us who pay taxes lose half or more of what we earn to provide against our will.   How insane is it to pay for those who break our laws?  Citizenship was never intended to be applied to lawbreakers and invaders.  That provision was to cover current residents and their children who resided in the new Republic.</p>
<p>Good question, Christina and Doug.  Do YOU pay taxes?  INCOME taxes?  Over half of all US citizens do NOT.  That doesn&#8217;t count the illegals, who don&#8217;t, either.  How long do you think that we, if you pay, can continue to fund lifestyles of idleness?  Why should we, the rest of us?  It would make more sense to stop enabling the mentality of dependence.   And&#8230;I really have no interest in how you provide for yourselves.  I am neither related to you nor acquainted with you, and neither of you has been so little as polite. </p>
<p>It isn&#8217;t any fun being Cassandra, Christina, Doug, and those who believe as they do.  I do not proclaim Doom &amp; Gloom for fun.  I&#8217;m crying &#8220;Wolf!&#8221; for real while sticking my finger in the dike.  BAD times are coming, and your precious governments and votes aren&#8217;t going to be able to do a thing about it except shoot people and confiscate private stores.  </p>
<p>You haven&#8217;t gotten the real message:  for all those you envy because we have &#8220;more&#8221; than you do, there are untold thousands who lust after what YOU have.  WE are robbed by threat of fines and incarceration.  Those below you on the socioeconomic scale may well take from you at the points of knives and guns, by their fists, by their mobs.  We have &#8220;more&#8221; than you because we did without while others whooped it up in the credit bubble.  We worked forty years and saved.  We looked for bargains.  Everything we have is invested in our ranch, our livelihood and security for the future&#8211;if no one wrests it from us by force.  Many will want to.</p>
<p>If you have a vehicle, you could buy and sell something like seven average Chinese families on the proceeds.  No, I don&#8217;t expect to be invaded by the Chinese.  Not for&#8230;thirty years, maybe?  COULD happen then.  Probably won&#8217;t, because the USA will have become a third world country nobody wants.   Instead of railing at me for being your usual insults (mean-spirited, selfish, prejudiced, heartless, the whole meaningless catch phrase assortment), I suggest, yet again, that you look to your hole cards.  You have three choices coming up:  you can be prepared and protect what you have&#8230;or you can die&#8230;or you can take by force what you have been stealing by force of numbers.  If you wish to continue this discourse, move it over to <a href="http://www.thetexasring.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.thetexasring.com</a>.  If you want to go away and sulk and call me names, that&#8217;s fine, too.  LBT</p>
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		<title>By: Tony De Maio</title>
		<link>http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/safety-net-the-path-to-slavery/comment-page-1/#comment-3697</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony De Maio</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Oct 2009 04:32:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/?p=5416#comment-3697</guid>
		<description>Doug,

You&#039;re not &quot;locked out&quot;.  Apparently the site is set up so that messages are not immediately posted.

Yes, I assume you are a liberal.  I&#039;m old enough to where I can pretty much spot them by the language they use.  I suspect you are a liberal leaning somewhat toward libertarian--but not so much of a libertarian you don&#039;t believe in federal aid, and probably more liberal than libertarian.  

When you think about it, except for some closed systems like mathematics, ALL knowledge is &quot;assumptions&quot;--sometimes based upon evidence, sometimes not.  Even in math, you START with assumptions.

When I hear folks throwing around words like &quot;pseudo conservative&quot;, &quot;war monger&quot;, &quot;afraid of&quot;, &quot;cowardly&quot;, and of course the ubiquitous&quot;obcene&quot;, I know I&#039;m dealing with someone who deals in name calling instead of  facts and logic--hence, a liberal.

As I sed in my last post, 

&quot;Whether the comparison is justified or not in view of all the facts is probably open to question. The image of those folks chanting and the consistency with my perception of reality is simply too stark to be ignored.&quot;

You want other examples where folks chant and yell and demonstrate to obtain benefits instead of working for them or helping themselves, I&#039;m sure MANY folks can provide MANY examples.  Saw a few on Fox News the other night when ACORN &quot;invaded&quot; various commercial enterprises, picketed, trespassed into offices, etc. in order to &quot;get help&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doug,</p>
<p>You&#8217;re not &#8220;locked out&#8221;.  Apparently the site is set up so that messages are not immediately posted.</p>
<p>Yes, I assume you are a liberal.  I&#8217;m old enough to where I can pretty much spot them by the language they use.  I suspect you are a liberal leaning somewhat toward libertarian&#8211;but not so much of a libertarian you don&#8217;t believe in federal aid, and probably more liberal than libertarian.  </p>
<p>When you think about it, except for some closed systems like mathematics, ALL knowledge is &#8220;assumptions&#8221;&#8211;sometimes based upon evidence, sometimes not.  Even in math, you START with assumptions.</p>
<p>When I hear folks throwing around words like &#8220;pseudo conservative&#8221;, &#8220;war monger&#8221;, &#8220;afraid of&#8221;, &#8220;cowardly&#8221;, and of course the ubiquitous&#8221;obcene&#8221;, I know I&#8217;m dealing with someone who deals in name calling instead of  facts and logic&#8211;hence, a liberal.</p>
<p>As I sed in my last post, </p>
<p>&#8220;Whether the comparison is justified or not in view of all the facts is probably open to question. The image of those folks chanting and the consistency with my perception of reality is simply too stark to be ignored.&#8221;</p>
<p>You want other examples where folks chant and yell and demonstrate to obtain benefits instead of working for them or helping themselves, I&#8217;m sure MANY folks can provide MANY examples.  Saw a few on Fox News the other night when ACORN &#8220;invaded&#8221; various commercial enterprises, picketed, trespassed into offices, etc. in order to &#8220;get help&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: rancherlady</title>
		<link>http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/safety-net-the-path-to-slavery/comment-page-1/#comment-3690</link>
		<dc:creator>rancherlady</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Oct 2009 23:47:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/?p=5416#comment-3690</guid>
		<description>My dear Bidwacker:  I&#039;ve been around here a lot longer than the fantastic Mr. De Maio, so I am in a position to assure you that there is NO censorship here other than as stated in the comment rules.  &quot;Doug&quot; is allowed to be as rude to me as he pleases--which is very--and we attempt to engage in sensible discourse.  People use language sweet little old ladies like me find offensive.  Please tell me how you concluded that we deserve your strictures.  Name names and cite instances.  Please tell us where you get your news.  I don&#039;t listen to Mr. Limbaugh or watch Fox News; I read dozens of reports and articles a day.  If you want to dissent, why are you here?  If you don&#039;t want our views, why are you here?  If you want people who agree with your every word why don&#039;t you just talk to them?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My dear Bidwacker:  I&#8217;ve been around here a lot longer than the fantastic Mr. De Maio, so I am in a position to assure you that there is NO censorship here other than as stated in the comment rules.  &#8220;Doug&#8221; is allowed to be as rude to me as he pleases&#8211;which is very&#8211;and we attempt to engage in sensible discourse.  People use language sweet little old ladies like me find offensive.  Please tell me how you concluded that we deserve your strictures.  Name names and cite instances.  Please tell us where you get your news.  I don&#8217;t listen to Mr. Limbaugh or watch Fox News; I read dozens of reports and articles a day.  If you want to dissent, why are you here?  If you don&#8217;t want our views, why are you here?  If you want people who agree with your every word why don&#8217;t you just talk to them?</p>
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		<title>By: bidwacker</title>
		<link>http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/safety-net-the-path-to-slavery/comment-page-1/#comment-3657</link>
		<dc:creator>bidwacker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Oct 2009 18:42:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/?p=5416#comment-3657</guid>
		<description>This site is a pathetic joke written by a bunch of Rush Limbaugh , Fox News  , George Bush apologist. I tried to respond and have been locked out . I guess pseudo conservatives are afraid of dissent. Real conservatives do not believe in nanny states or govt deficits . Drug wars , same sex marriage laws and filling jails with people who commit consensual crimes.  Ron Paul see the industrial military state as obscene yet most people who call them selves conservtaives are war mongers.  Will this make it through Gibson&#039;s cowardly censoring we will see as for me I am done with it and will continue to get my news from real conservatives not apologist.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This site is a pathetic joke written by a bunch of Rush Limbaugh , Fox News  , George Bush apologist. I tried to respond and have been locked out . I guess pseudo conservatives are afraid of dissent. Real conservatives do not believe in nanny states or govt deficits . Drug wars , same sex marriage laws and filling jails with people who commit consensual crimes.  Ron Paul see the industrial military state as obscene yet most people who call them selves conservtaives are war mongers.  Will this make it through Gibson&#8217;s cowardly censoring we will see as for me I am done with it and will continue to get my news from real conservatives not apologist.</p>
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		<title>By: Doug</title>
		<link>http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/safety-net-the-path-to-slavery/comment-page-1/#comment-3656</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Oct 2009 17:07:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/?p=5416#comment-3656</guid>
		<description>I seemed to be locked out so maybe this site is not as open to debate as advertised so I using a different email.Here&#039;s how a debate goes you make statement people should of walked out . I point out that was impossible . I mistakenly believe you live in California from you post and try and reference that ,Linda jumps in . I did not try and quell any debate and your assumption that I am a liberal is just that . I believe in real conservatism not the pseudo Bush apologist , Rush Limbaugh ,Fox News loving kind . I never said that govt was the answer . The massive deficits that started under Reagan are every bit as bad as the ones under Obama. I believe that the govt has no business in telling you what you can smoke,sleep with, marry or do as long as its consensual . Like Ron Paul I believe that Military follies of Bush were wrong and created nothing and will bankrupt this country.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I seemed to be locked out so maybe this site is not as open to debate as advertised so I using a different email.Here&#8217;s how a debate goes you make statement people should of walked out . I point out that was impossible . I mistakenly believe you live in California from you post and try and reference that ,Linda jumps in . I did not try and quell any debate and your assumption that I am a liberal is just that . I believe in real conservatism not the pseudo Bush apologist , Rush Limbaugh ,Fox News loving kind . I never said that govt was the answer . The massive deficits that started under Reagan are every bit as bad as the ones under Obama. I believe that the govt has no business in telling you what you can smoke,sleep with, marry or do as long as its consensual . Like Ron Paul I believe that Military follies of Bush were wrong and created nothing and will bankrupt this country.</p>
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		<title>By: Doug</title>
		<link>http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/safety-net-the-path-to-slavery/comment-page-1/#comment-3655</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Oct 2009 16:49:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/?p=5416#comment-3655</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s how a debate goes you make statement people should of walked out . I point out that was impossible . I mistakenly believe you live in California from you post and try and reference that ,Linda jumps in . I did not try and quell any debate and your assumption that I am a liberal is just that . I believe in real conservatism not the pseudo Bush apologist , Rush Limbaugh ,Fox News loving kind . I never said that govt was the answer . The massive deficits that started under Reagan are every bit as bad as the ones under Obama. I believe that the govt has no business in telling you what you can smoke,sleep with, marry or do as long as its consensual . Like Ron Paul I believe that Military Fascism of Bush is wrong and created nothing and will bankrupt this country.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s how a debate goes you make statement people should of walked out . I point out that was impossible . I mistakenly believe you live in California from you post and try and reference that ,Linda jumps in . I did not try and quell any debate and your assumption that I am a liberal is just that . I believe in real conservatism not the pseudo Bush apologist , Rush Limbaugh ,Fox News loving kind . I never said that govt was the answer . The massive deficits that started under Reagan are every bit as bad as the ones under Obama. I believe that the govt has no business in telling you what you can smoke,sleep with, marry or do as long as its consensual . Like Ron Paul I believe that Military Fascism of Bush is wrong and created nothing and will bankrupt this country.</p>
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		<title>By: Tony De Maio</title>
		<link>http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/safety-net-the-path-to-slavery/comment-page-1/#comment-3654</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony De Maio</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Oct 2009 15:47:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/?p=5416#comment-3654</guid>
		<description>Doug,

1.  Not that it is relevant, but I do not live in California.  I had sense enough to move.  I can foresee the disaster that will hit (or perhaps is hitting) that state as they continue to use tax money for social purposes/programs.  How in heck a state that is &quot;broke&quot; can spend billions for stem cell research and a high speed train is beyond me.  I guess they do it by borrowing.

Incidently, I do not approve of federal aid to those nuts who built houses on a cliff.

2.  I seem to recall an event in history called the San Francisco earthquake.  The problem was solved without the federal government.  

3.  You can play &quot;what if&quot; games all day.  What if I break my leg, should YOU pay for it?  You ignore the fundamental question of, &quot;Why is my misfortune a claim on my neighbor?&quot;  and who is to judge which claims our neighbors will be liable for? 

4.  When Ike hit, our mayor sent $5,000 to help.  I protested.  You see, Doug, while the &quot;intent&quot; and &quot;purpose&quot; were noble, IT WASN&#039;T HER MONEY TO SPEND.  That money was to run the city.  I don&#039;t know what YOU call it when you take money for one purpose and use it for another, but where I come from we call it FRAUD.  I called a talk show and publicly made her the following proposition.  Let us compare the amount each of us PERSONALLY sent for relief, and the one who contributed least will make up the difference to the other.  Of course, she didn&#039;t take me up on it.

What&#039;s the old joke??  A liberal is a person who feels a great responsibility to his fellow man which he wishes to discharge with YOUR money.

5.  Can show me where benevolence is addressed in the Constitution.  (Please don&#039;t state &quot;promote the general welfare&quot; unless you look up what is meant by that historically.)

6.  Sho &#039;nuff, you can be left with nothing even if you do take precautions and (e.g.) stockpile.  Welcome to life.  Does that mean that you should NOT take precautions?  NOT buy insurance?  NOT save for unexpected circumstances?  Of course it does, because if you DO, you do not qualify for federal help.  Ain&#039;t it strange they are talking about &quot;means testing&quot; Social Security.

Psychology has been around about 300 years.  During that time, it appears to have come up with two laws:

a.  Rewarded behavior is repeated behavior
b.  Non rewarded and punished behavior is not repeated

Doug, what behavior are we rewarding in this country?

7.  Finally, I thought this was a discussion board.  I see no reason to curtail debate from anyone.  As far as I&#039;m concerned, anyone can jump in, even Linda.  Why is it liberals want to silence opposition?  (I&#039;ve written on that subject also.)

always,
tony</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doug,</p>
<p>1.  Not that it is relevant, but I do not live in California.  I had sense enough to move.  I can foresee the disaster that will hit (or perhaps is hitting) that state as they continue to use tax money for social purposes/programs.  How in heck a state that is &#8220;broke&#8221; can spend billions for stem cell research and a high speed train is beyond me.  I guess they do it by borrowing.</p>
<p>Incidently, I do not approve of federal aid to those nuts who built houses on a cliff.</p>
<p>2.  I seem to recall an event in history called the San Francisco earthquake.  The problem was solved without the federal government.  </p>
<p>3.  You can play &#8220;what if&#8221; games all day.  What if I break my leg, should YOU pay for it?  You ignore the fundamental question of, &#8220;Why is my misfortune a claim on my neighbor?&#8221;  and who is to judge which claims our neighbors will be liable for? </p>
<p>4.  When Ike hit, our mayor sent $5,000 to help.  I protested.  You see, Doug, while the &#8220;intent&#8221; and &#8220;purpose&#8221; were noble, IT WASN&#8217;T HER MONEY TO SPEND.  That money was to run the city.  I don&#8217;t know what YOU call it when you take money for one purpose and use it for another, but where I come from we call it FRAUD.  I called a talk show and publicly made her the following proposition.  Let us compare the amount each of us PERSONALLY sent for relief, and the one who contributed least will make up the difference to the other.  Of course, she didn&#8217;t take me up on it.</p>
<p>What&#8217;s the old joke??  A liberal is a person who feels a great responsibility to his fellow man which he wishes to discharge with YOUR money.</p>
<p>5.  Can show me where benevolence is addressed in the Constitution.  (Please don&#8217;t state &#8220;promote the general welfare&#8221; unless you look up what is meant by that historically.)</p>
<p>6.  Sho &#8217;nuff, you can be left with nothing even if you do take precautions and (e.g.) stockpile.  Welcome to life.  Does that mean that you should NOT take precautions?  NOT buy insurance?  NOT save for unexpected circumstances?  Of course it does, because if you DO, you do not qualify for federal help.  Ain&#8217;t it strange they are talking about &#8220;means testing&#8221; Social Security.</p>
<p>Psychology has been around about 300 years.  During that time, it appears to have come up with two laws:</p>
<p>a.  Rewarded behavior is repeated behavior<br />
b.  Non rewarded and punished behavior is not repeated</p>
<p>Doug, what behavior are we rewarding in this country?</p>
<p>7.  Finally, I thought this was a discussion board.  I see no reason to curtail debate from anyone.  As far as I&#8217;m concerned, anyone can jump in, even Linda.  Why is it liberals want to silence opposition?  (I&#8217;ve written on that subject also.)</p>
<p>always,<br />
tony</p>
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		<title>By: Doug</title>
		<link>http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/safety-net-the-path-to-slavery/comment-page-1/#comment-3647</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Oct 2009 02:09:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/?p=5416#comment-3647</guid>
		<description>From Wikipedia your roof blowing off story does not compare to being surrounded by water with no way out.,

The Federal Emergency Management Agency was heavily criticized in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina, primarily for its slow response and inability to coordinate its efforts with other federal agencies relief organizations. Chicago Mayor Richard Daley, said of the slow Federal response, &quot;I was shocked. We are ready to provide considerably more help than they have requested. We are just waiting for the call. I don&#039;t want to sit here and all of a sudden we are all going to be political. Just get it done.&quot;[26]

FEMA was accused of deliberately slowing things down, in an effort to ensure that all assistance and relief workers were coordinated properly. For example, Michael D. Brown, the head of FEMA, on August 29, urged all fire and emergency services departments not to respond to counties and states affected by Hurricane Katrina without being requested and lawfully dispatched by state and local authorities under mutual aid agreements and the Emergency Management Assistance Compact.[27]

FEMA also interfered in the Astor Hotel&#039;s&#039; plans to hire 10 buses to carry approximately 500 guests to higher ground. Federal officials commandeered the buses, and told the guests to join thousands of other evacuees at the Ernest N. Morial Convention Center.[28] In other instances of FEMA asserting its authority to only ultimately make things worse, FEMA officials turned away three Wal-Mart trailer trucks loaded with water, prevented the Coast Guard from delivering 1,000 gallons of diesel fuel, and on Saturday they cut the Jefferson Parish emergency communications line, leading the sheriff to restore it and post armed guards to protect it from FEMA.[29] The Wal-Mart delivery had actually been turned away a week earlier, on Sunday, August 28, before the hurricane struck. A caravan of 13 Wal-Mart tractor trailers was reported in New Orleans by September 1.[30] Additionally, more than 50 civilian aircraft responding to separate requests for evacuations from hospitals and other agencies swarmed to the area a day after Katrina hit, but FEMA blocked their efforts. Aircraft operators complained that FEMA waved off a number of evacuation attempts, saying the rescuers were not authorized. &quot;Many planes and helicopters simply sat idle,&quot; said Thomas Judge, president of the Assn. of Air Medical Services.[31]

Senator Mary Landrieu (D-Louisiana), was particularly critical of FEMA&#039;s efforts in a statement: &quot;[T]he U.S. Forest Service had water-tanker aircraft available to help douse the fires raging on our riverfront, but FEMA has yet to accept the aid. When Amtrak offered trains to evacuate significant numbers of victims—far more efficiently than buses—FEMA again dragged its feet. Offers of medicine, communications equipment and other desperately needed items continue to flow in, only to be ignored by the agency. But perhaps the greatest disappointment stands at the breached 17th Street levee. Touring this critical site yesterday with the President, I saw what I believed to be a real and significant effort to get a handle on a major cause of this catastrophe. Flying over this critical spot again this morning, less than 24 hours later, it became apparent that yesterday we witnessed a hastily prepared stage set for a Presidential photo opportunity; and the desperately needed resources we saw were this morning reduced to a single, lonely piece of equipment. The good and decent people of southeast Louisiana and the Gulf Coast—black and white, rich and poor, young and old—deserve far better from their national government.&quot;[32] However, Landrieu&#039;s overflight was of the end of the single-lane roadway being built toward the breach. The &quot;single, lonely piece of equipment&quot; was one power shovel, a bulldozer, and two dump trucks. Video did not show the work area a few hundred feet away at the start of the roadway. USACE photos show a variety of equipment at that site the following day.[citation needed]

The New York Times reported that 91,000 tons of ice ordered by FEMA at a cost of over $100 million and intended for hospitals and food storage for relief efforts never made it to the disaster area. Federally contracted truck drivers instead received orders from FEMA to deliver the ice to government rented storage facilities around the country, as far north as Maine. In testimony to a House panel, FEMA director Michael D. Brown stated that &quot;I don&#039;t think that&#039;s a federal government responsibility to provide ice to keep my hamburger meat in my freezer or refrigerator fresh.&quot;[33]

In a September 15, 2005 New York Times opinion column about the privately owned Methodist Hospital in New Orleans, Bob Herbert wrote, &quot;Incredibly, when the out-of-state corporate owners of the hospital responded to the flooding by sending emergency relief supplies, they were confiscated at the airport by FEMA.&quot;[34]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From Wikipedia your roof blowing off story does not compare to being surrounded by water with no way out.,</p>
<p>The Federal Emergency Management Agency was heavily criticized in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina, primarily for its slow response and inability to coordinate its efforts with other federal agencies relief organizations. Chicago Mayor Richard Daley, said of the slow Federal response, &#8220;I was shocked. We are ready to provide considerably more help than they have requested. We are just waiting for the call. I don&#8217;t want to sit here and all of a sudden we are all going to be political. Just get it done.&#8221;[26]</p>
<p>FEMA was accused of deliberately slowing things down, in an effort to ensure that all assistance and relief workers were coordinated properly. For example, Michael D. Brown, the head of FEMA, on August 29, urged all fire and emergency services departments not to respond to counties and states affected by Hurricane Katrina without being requested and lawfully dispatched by state and local authorities under mutual aid agreements and the Emergency Management Assistance Compact.[27]</p>
<p>FEMA also interfered in the Astor Hotel&#8217;s&#8217; plans to hire 10 buses to carry approximately 500 guests to higher ground. Federal officials commandeered the buses, and told the guests to join thousands of other evacuees at the Ernest N. Morial Convention Center.[28] In other instances of FEMA asserting its authority to only ultimately make things worse, FEMA officials turned away three Wal-Mart trailer trucks loaded with water, prevented the Coast Guard from delivering 1,000 gallons of diesel fuel, and on Saturday they cut the Jefferson Parish emergency communications line, leading the sheriff to restore it and post armed guards to protect it from FEMA.[29] The Wal-Mart delivery had actually been turned away a week earlier, on Sunday, August 28, before the hurricane struck. A caravan of 13 Wal-Mart tractor trailers was reported in New Orleans by September 1.[30] Additionally, more than 50 civilian aircraft responding to separate requests for evacuations from hospitals and other agencies swarmed to the area a day after Katrina hit, but FEMA blocked their efforts. Aircraft operators complained that FEMA waved off a number of evacuation attempts, saying the rescuers were not authorized. &#8220;Many planes and helicopters simply sat idle,&#8221; said Thomas Judge, president of the Assn. of Air Medical Services.[31]</p>
<p>Senator Mary Landrieu (D-Louisiana), was particularly critical of FEMA&#8217;s efforts in a statement: &#8220;[T]he U.S. Forest Service had water-tanker aircraft available to help douse the fires raging on our riverfront, but FEMA has yet to accept the aid. When Amtrak offered trains to evacuate significant numbers of victims—far more efficiently than buses—FEMA again dragged its feet. Offers of medicine, communications equipment and other desperately needed items continue to flow in, only to be ignored by the agency. But perhaps the greatest disappointment stands at the breached 17th Street levee. Touring this critical site yesterday with the President, I saw what I believed to be a real and significant effort to get a handle on a major cause of this catastrophe. Flying over this critical spot again this morning, less than 24 hours later, it became apparent that yesterday we witnessed a hastily prepared stage set for a Presidential photo opportunity; and the desperately needed resources we saw were this morning reduced to a single, lonely piece of equipment. The good and decent people of southeast Louisiana and the Gulf Coast—black and white, rich and poor, young and old—deserve far better from their national government.&#8221;[32] However, Landrieu&#8217;s overflight was of the end of the single-lane roadway being built toward the breach. The &#8220;single, lonely piece of equipment&#8221; was one power shovel, a bulldozer, and two dump trucks. Video did not show the work area a few hundred feet away at the start of the roadway. USACE photos show a variety of equipment at that site the following day.[citation needed]</p>
<p>The New York Times reported that 91,000 tons of ice ordered by FEMA at a cost of over $100 million and intended for hospitals and food storage for relief efforts never made it to the disaster area. Federally contracted truck drivers instead received orders from FEMA to deliver the ice to government rented storage facilities around the country, as far north as Maine. In testimony to a House panel, FEMA director Michael D. Brown stated that &#8220;I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s a federal government responsibility to provide ice to keep my hamburger meat in my freezer or refrigerator fresh.&#8221;[33]</p>
<p>In a September 15, 2005 New York Times opinion column about the privately owned Methodist Hospital in New Orleans, Bob Herbert wrote, &#8220;Incredibly, when the out-of-state corporate owners of the hospital responded to the flooding by sending emergency relief supplies, they were confiscated at the airport by FEMA.&#8221;[34]</p>
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		<title>By: Doug</title>
		<link>http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/safety-net-the-path-to-slavery/comment-page-1/#comment-3646</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Oct 2009 01:55:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/?p=5416#comment-3646</guid>
		<description>I believe I was talking to Tony, Rancherlady and his response to Christina and why don&#039;t you give me an actual link with your the Fema trucks could not get in response, and  make it an actual news site. And god knows that a place like Texas is free of tornadoes , wild fires. droughts , hurricanes and floods . My point there is no place anywhere that is not subject to some force of nature .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe I was talking to Tony, Rancherlady and his response to Christina and why don&#8217;t you give me an actual link with your the Fema trucks could not get in response, and  make it an actual news site. And god knows that a place like Texas is free of tornadoes , wild fires. droughts , hurricanes and floods . My point there is no place anywhere that is not subject to some force of nature .</p>
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		<title>By: rancherlady</title>
		<link>http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/safety-net-the-path-to-slavery/comment-page-1/#comment-3640</link>
		<dc:creator>rancherlady</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Oct 2009 00:44:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whiskeyandgunpowder.com/?p=5416#comment-3640</guid>
		<description>Doug, dear...still not my problem.  Anyone who lives in a whacko place like California, on top of known, active fault lines, deserves what he gets.  I have a very wealthy relative who does; gracious, one quake emptied her swimming pool.  HER idea of disaster preparedness is a platinum card and a case of perrier!  No, I did NOT make that up.  She told me once that her idea of roughing it is attempting to check into the Empress, in Victoria, without a reservation.  Horrors!  Whatever our means, we can take responsibility for our own behavior.  Multiple fault lines have opened up in social, financial, political, and economic areas and anyone not at least eyeing hills to run to is going to suffer the consequences.  Cordially, Linda</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doug, dear&#8230;still not my problem.  Anyone who lives in a whacko place like California, on top of known, active fault lines, deserves what he gets.  I have a very wealthy relative who does; gracious, one quake emptied her swimming pool.  HER idea of disaster preparedness is a platinum card and a case of perrier!  No, I did NOT make that up.  She told me once that her idea of roughing it is attempting to check into the Empress, in Victoria, without a reservation.  Horrors!  Whatever our means, we can take responsibility for our own behavior.  Multiple fault lines have opened up in social, financial, political, and economic areas and anyone not at least eyeing hills to run to is going to suffer the consequences.  Cordially, Linda</p>
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